It’s Not Whether You Win or Lose…….
It’s how you play the game.
David Kirby, on the other hand, persists in wanting to debate about whether or not vaccines or something in vaccines can be linked to autism, as he writes in the November 30th Huffington Post. The Autism-Vaccine Debate: Anything But Over begins with a boldface statement.
Memo to those who wanted the autism-vaccine contretemps to just go away: You lost.
Kirby cites three pieces of evidence: (1) A new CDS-fundedstudy “will explore genetic and environmental reasons for the rapid rise in diagnosed cases” is to “explore genetic and environmental reasons for the rapid rise in diagnosed cases.” Vaccines are one of various potential causes being studied, though Kirby’s presentation of the study might lead one to think that vaccines are the focus. (2) Lyn Redwood, the president of Safe Minds—”a leading advocate of the mercury-vaccine-autism connection”—has been appointed by Secretary of Health and Human Services (HHS) to what Kirby terms a “new federal panel,” the Interagency Autism Coordinating Committee (IACC). While there are number of new members on this committee, it is not “new.” ASA president Lee Grossman was previously a member of the IACC and, while he has argued (as Kirby points out) that vaccines “can cause the disorder,” a number of Grossman’s comments on at the IACC meeting on November 30th were about services, especially for autistic adults.
The third reason that Kirby cites as evidence that those who think the vaccine-autism theory have “lost” is because the US Justice Department and HHS have conceded a case that was to argue that “vaccines caused the ’significant aggravation’ of an underlying condition.” Kirby sees the governmen’s concession as evidence that they did not wish for this case to go to trial, lest it be proved that vaccines might be a cause of autism:
According to my source, however, the government is NOT conceding that mercury or vaccines cause autism. “In this case, the DOJ conceded that vaccines significantly aggravated a child’s pre-existing autistic symptoms,” my source said, “but the autism itself was caused by a congenital mitochondrial disorder that is entirely genetic.”
And, the source noted, “By conceding ’significant aggravation,’ I think DOJ is trying to avoid ever having this case go to hearing on the underlying causation issue.”
In other words, this was likely going to be a slam-dunk, and the Feds knew it. Rather than risk having the case become a “test” for thousands of other claims, it looks like the DOJ opted to fold and pay out damages to the family, without actually admitting that vaccines can cause autism.
Excuse me while I slam on the brakes to Kirby’s rhetoric: Doesn’t the “source” say that the child in question had “pre-existing autistic symptoms”? That is, per this “source,” the child was showing signs of autism before the vaccinations which “aggravated” something that the child already had (autism). Some will be glad to point out that I, in (sore) loser fashion, am not reading this passage by Kirby right; I am glad to concede that various other parties can say what they will. I was spoken to quite vehemently to my face by another person today: Sometimes people just don’t agree.
Anyways, unlike Kirby, I prefer not to perseverate on the topic of whether vaccines or something in vaccines causes autism. There’s too much else to do in taking care my son Charlie—-in living and making the most of each day with him, listening to his latest words, standing beside him at the piano and showing him to play C sharp in the D major scale. Charlie became autistic a long time ago and whatever feelings of rage or puzzlement or sadness about his diagnosis I may once felt have ebbed away. It can happen, when you’re busy leading the good life every day with a great kid—a great friend—and not worrying about whether or not you’ve “won” debates: Charlie gives me plenty else to talk about.
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POSTED IN: Autism Organizations, Rhetoric, Vaccines
18 opinions for It’s Not Whether You Win or Lose…….
feebee
Dec 1, 2007 at 2:04 am
But for the first-person language, I’d have thought I was reading another blogger’s writings… ;-)
Sing it, sister!
Kassiane
Dec 1, 2007 at 3:54 am
…if there was a mitochondrial disorder then the DOJ just wanted them to SHUT UP. Silence, what a priceless gift!
Mito disorders are the most unpredictable on the PLANET. But heaven forbid Kirby do research! Gah nooo!
Sorry you got in person trolled. You must have done something right.
Rose
Dec 1, 2007 at 7:54 am
Confession time.
I am still on the rolls as a parent who the partners at Wallace hope to make big money off of. I refused to “chelate” Ben a few years back. I figured I’d never hear from them again, but a couple of months ago, I guess they decided even non-chelators could get in on it. I think there are 3-4,000 of us.
This time I refused to sign on because they wanted info on Ben’s birth. It was a private adoption and I didn’t want them bugging his birth mother, so…guess we’ll wait a few more years.
Ben DID have a hypotonic-hyporesponsive episode directly after receiving his DPT, DTP, I can never remember. Although he doesn’t have Tuberis Sclerosis, as far as I know…a similar reaction is what helps bring about a TS diagnosis in other babies.
Pre-existing condition. Our kids are sensitive in more ways than one.
I love the way you refer to Charlie as a great friend. Ben is probably one of the best friends I will ever have. I enjoy his company every day. We feed off of each other.
In the beginning, I was a “may-tar” (the way Ben thought martyr was pronounced) but now you would have to fight me to the death to change one thing about him.
RAJ
Dec 1, 2007 at 10:44 am
“I was spoken to quite vehemently to my face by another person today: Sometimes people just don’t agree”.
Kristina;
Please don’t play the sympathy card. What do you expect. All I see from your website is the endless hurling of insults, character assassination and hatred directed primarily at Jenny McCarthy, because you ‘disagree’ with her views.
Kristina Chew, PhD
Dec 1, 2007 at 10:48 am
Sympathy for getting yelled at?
On the contrary, Bring it on!
Autismville
Dec 1, 2007 at 11:45 am
I’ve decided to stick with love …Hate is too great a burden to bear …
I must admit when I read the latest from Kirby I always feel a twinge of exploitation. I guess it’s the accountant in me … How much money is he making off of selling books, writing articles, and speaking at various conferences I wonder. What are his other sources of income? Are all of his eggs in the vaccine basket?
It’s difficult for me not to be skeptical.
Kristina Chew, PhD
Dec 1, 2007 at 11:55 am
I gather that Kirby is writing another book on the environment and its effects on health more generally, and on mercury and damage from other toxins.
Love is behind it all for me—thank you for bringing that up.
Regan
Dec 1, 2007 at 12:00 pm
Sometimes people don’t agree.
That’s the way it is, and as I tell the kids, yelling isn’t going to make it any different, and probably even less so.
I thought the Huff post was a little premature on the CDC study–unless I misread, they awarded the grants, not announced the results. I assume that they still have to do the research.
ASDmomNC
Dec 1, 2007 at 12:38 pm
Ooo, careful there Kristina…you know the whole tinfoil hat/vaccines are the devil meme is basically a religion, don’t you? The following is fanatical and fierce, and heaven forbid you refuse to “convert” to their way of thinking. ;)
Fee, you wouldn’t be talking about MOI, would you?
autismdaddy
Dec 1, 2007 at 12:53 pm
Hi Kristina,
As a new blogger but old lurker I’d like to say that I admire your blog very much. I have read Mr Kirby’s book and remain distinctly unimpressed with the logic of it. This blog seems to continue that trend. He says that the government are conceding that vaccines aggravated a childs existing autism condition. Or at least his mysterious, nameless, faceless source is. When I read the Special Masters words however, I see no mention of this pre-existing condition being autism:
“Within the past week we learned that respondentis conceding in one of
the potential cases vaccines caused the “significant aggravation” of
an underlying condition. That case in procedural posture that makes it
as a test case for hearing in May 2008.”
I may be new to blogging, but as I say I have been lurking for a long time and this seems to be something of a pattern for Mr Kirby - inserting fictional extras into others statements. Hopefully my blogging can be more honest and respectful.
autismdaddy
Dec 1, 2007 at 12:54 pm
It would of course help if I’d put the right web link for my new site! I have in this entry.
Kristina Chew, PhD
Dec 1, 2007 at 1:23 pm
I’m looking forward to reading what you have to say—and thank you so much for reading Autism Vox. I guess I would have to say, those “fictional extras” undermine all the “evidence” cited….
Kristina Chew, PhD
Dec 1, 2007 at 1:35 pm
It was not (as far as I know) on behalf of Jenny McCarthy that said other party castigated me. I have beem called a lot worse driving up Sip Avenue in Jersey City…..
feebee
Dec 1, 2007 at 2:00 pm
ASDMomNC:
In this case, my dear, I was referring to a certain Diva. I presume you know of whom I speak?
BTW: Did you make your hat out of that pretty red and green holiday foil?
Kristina Chew, PhD
Dec 1, 2007 at 2:11 pm
Am flattered by the comparison—-not able to feel her shoes.
TomsMom
Dec 2, 2007 at 2:38 pm
We live in a big country with lots of people, opinions and ways of coping with ASD. Sometimes it seems that the empty barrels not only make the most noise but the most money. The ASD spectrum means a tremendous diversity of situations among the 1:115 kids affected by it and their families. (In my own case I have a 5 year old boy with Asperger’s; cognitively he’s fine but he has relatively severe impulse and behavior problems.) Being lucky (i.e., well-educated, relatively well-off, with a decent school situation) I tend to be hopeful. The CDC study as described may soon provide us some sorely-needed facts and real stats and help separate the real from the mythological. It won’t stop some folks from perpetuating myth and other (desperate) folks from believing them, but it is still a positive development, no matter what spin some might apply.
Patrick
Dec 3, 2007 at 2:35 pm
Oh my, mr “I’m tired of autism” is rag(g)ing on again? And another no-properly-documented-evidence (as yet) book is in the works?
Thanks for the heads up, it will be interesting to see what the future tirades consist of.
_Arthur
Dec 4, 2007 at 3:33 pm
Kristina, I think that the child Kirby alludes to, would be the Yates, the H..z family, who is/was the second test case for the Vaccines Court.
My bet is that the Petitioners had to withdraw their test case, when it was shown to them that his condititon was NOT classic autism, making him an unsuitable test case. And making fools of the experts who were supposed to testify so.
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